Max Riffner
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Why So Weak Award
This is the first installment of the Why So Weak Award here on the Parlor. The award was something I’ve wanted to do for awhile, but didn’t have a good enough reason to justify a post. Last night I found that reason.
I went to the comic shop and picked up a copy of the new Dick Tracy collection. I was floored. Any sort of collection of Dick Tracy strips is hard to come by, but now it was finally getting its due, thanks to Fantagraphics. The publisher really struck a nerve when it got the rights to reprint all of the Peanuts strips a couple of years ago. With the simple vintage designs of cartoonist Seth hallmarking the series covers, I was sold on those hardcover reprints right from the get go. Seriously, what a great way to enjoy all those old Schulz strips.
Fantagraphics didn’t stop there. They also got the rights to reprint all the Popeye and Dennis the Menace strips also. Their presentation is similar (hardback, great paper), but their designs are unique to each property. I’ve enjoyed each of these packages aesthetically, so why did Fantagraphics retread the Seth/Peanuts design for Dick Tracy.
Then I saw that IDW had in fact published the book, not Fantagraphics.
So, IDW basically just ripped off the design.
Weak.
So, so weak.
Why, IDW? You are a good publisher! I admire your grit, your determination. In a time where most new publishers try every gimmick and trick out of the gate, you knew how to build it right: slowly. And not only that, you stuck to a core genre (horror), and have begun to branch out. Had I heard previously you were doing a collection of Dick Tracy strips similar to what Fantagraphics had been doing, sight unseen, I would have been excited to see it, to see how you would treat it.
You will make a buck or two on this deal, because as Erik Larsen pointed out in a recent article, there is a demand for Chester Gould’s work. Dick Tracy has been and influence on so many cartoonists. But you had to steal a design, didn’t you?
See, I was duped, as I’m sure a great many other consumers will be also. I thought this was the same company that had made the Peanuts collections (and other classics) available, and I know they treat the work with great reverence because of how they think about the entire package and how it will translate to the readers’ experience. However, by doing this, you are basically saying you don’t trust Gould’s work to stand out on the shelves on its own.
I’m a designer, so I know how the design-rip goes. Someone’s boss sees a banner ad on a website outperforming theirs, they make their designer create a new ad that looks similar to the better performing ad and they put it out there. Guess what? It works like a charm – I’ve seen it happen first hand. The new, similar ad will outperform its previous version despite the fact that it looks like another ad on the page (the only unknown factor is if the new ad cannibalizes click-through from the other company’s ad). The only difference being that it is a banner ad with a shelf life of maybe two weeks. This is a book that will be on people’s bookshelves for the rest of their life. If ever there was a time for a unique design, this was it.
So IDW, I bestow the first Why So Weak award. You could have had any plethora of cartoonists/designers who were fans and probably would have done a unique presentation for the book on the cheap (including Art Spiegleman, who gave you quote for crying out loud). Looking on the forums, it appears Ashley Wood created the design, which isn’t at all similar to his typical work.
I still bought the book. However, I think I’ll be designing my own cover for the ongoing collections. Please, before it gets too expensive, consider having the first two collections redesigned on a next printing.
Max, first off let me say that a ‘why so weak’ feature is brilliant. I wish I had thought of it myself, because as you know from our conversations, there’s plenty of material out there.
However, I think your initial offering could have chosen something so much weaker. Yeah, it’s kind of a hack job to so blatantly rip off another series of book’s design, especially when the material is so similar. That said, because the material is so similar, maybe IDW wanted to create an association in buyer’s minds with the Peanuts collections. As you said, Peanuts=quality, and so it may be a smart move on the part of IDW. Also, I took a gander at the Dick Tracy collection yesterday myself, and it is an attractive package. Derivative to be sure, but in no way is it shabby.
I’ve always considered design to be a bit like sampling in hip-hop. You borrow or steal bits and pieces from other works and cobble it together to make something new. Sometimes you get something new and genius, a DJ Shadow design if you will. And sometimes you get something totally unoriginal, or a Puff Daddy design. Obviously, IDW went the Puff Daddy route. And who knows, it might pay off, because as we all know, Puff has sold a lot more albums than Shadow.
So, I guess I’m agreeing and disagreeing with you. I think that stealing a design so blatantly is pretty weak, but I’m not sure it deserves ‘why so weak’ status, because, as I said before, it’s still an attractive package and IDW may have been smart to make the choice they made. And before you totally mock my position, let me leave you with a couple of quotes:
“Lesser artists borrow, great artists steal.�
Igor Stravinsky
“Never draw anything you can copy, never copy anything you can trace, never trace anything you can cut out and paste up.”
Wally Wood
“Bad artists copy. Great artists steal.”
Pablo Picasso
(who may have stolen the quote from Stravinsky, or vice versa. Either way, it’s pretty funny and sort of proves their point.)
I hate it when people trot those three quotes out to justify design theft. Hate it.
Here’s a recent post from Airbag on why stealing, borrowing or whatever you want to call it is bad, which sums up my feelings on the matter nicely:
Look, design doesn’t just happen. It’s a process of creation and deconstruction that can take days-to-months before every element, color, and bit of typography is in the right place. It’s not uncommon for me to go through twenty-plus revisions of a design (ask my friends, I bug them with show and tell all the time) before I show anything to a client, and by revisions I mean up and down, all around, starting over, building up, demolishing, it’s a circus of insanity. The final result is design that reflects my style, one that I have been working on for two decades and will continue to mold and shape for as long as I can. Every mature designer has his/her style and we are hired based of that unique look.
We designers catch a lot of crap on the web for crying foul over events like this but our food comes from the money we earn by being creative (some more than others). When someone “borrows� my work s/he is cheating because they didn’t have to go through the love and hate process that it took for us to create that layout or element detail or the whole damn thing. Where in the hell were they when I put in two weeks of fourteen hour days to get through the design phase of the project they just cut-and-pasted? When do I get my royalty fee? I’d go back and copy their work and resell it too only, uh oh, it doesn’t work both ways because the “designers� who repurposed my work suck. And if I was to try and rework their intellectual property and resell it back to my clients I’d be fired.
If Ashley Wood designed this, how can he not owe Seth at least a beer, because it looks nothing like an Ashley Wood piece and everything like Seth’s personal style and sense of design. Whomever designed it owes an apology, regardless.
But back to the quotes – I think this post says it best when it comes to the defenders of design theft:
The most effective response to this line of reasoning avoids that logical quagmire and instead asks whether Vanilla Ice, in light of Ice Ice Baby’s outright appropriation of the bass line from Under Pressure, should immediately be elevated to the pantheon of great artists.
So my friend, trot the quotes out as you may, but you risk me lumping you into the Vanilla Ice camp. Sorry, but it’s true, and it’s still weak.
tIMNov 2, 05:08 AM
C – Yeah, but hip-hop artists sample from something old making something new and different. They don’t sample from what they heard last week because that is considered, how you say, “biting.”
The designs, subject matter and market are too similar not to consider this as a bogus attempt to lure people to their product. It’s like knock-off Transformers or GI Joe’s you got when you were a kid. Just not as cool, and you knew it, but mom and dad swore they were the real thing. Dupped by fakers.
tIMNov 2, 05:11 AM
PS
Bad artists copy. Great artists steal.�
Pablo Picasso
I’d rather be the artist that Pablo ripped from.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Vanilla Ice? That’s harsh.
I didn’t intend to sound like a design theft advocate in the way that I probably came across. You know me. You’ve worked with me. You know my work ethic. So, you should also know that I didn’t pull those quotes out to simply “justify design theft.” The reason I pulled out the quotes from those guys was really to point out that lifting, in any medium, isn’t anything new. And I picked those particular artists because they were geniuses, not talentless hacks like Vanilla (I probably should have just stuck my Puff Daddy and DJ Shadow metaphor because it makes more sense). I mean it’s not like I quoted Rob Liefeld or something. When these guys stole, whatever it was they stole, they were still able to create something original out of it. In the case of the Dick Tracy book, Ashley Wood obviously didn’t. Which is why I compared him to Puff Daddy. And I agreed it was pretty weak. I just wasn’t sure it warranted the Why So Weak Award.
I guess it’s just that I know that IDW is a small publisher who made only $333,492 in sales in August. They are publishing a book here that appeals to a very small niche market within another small niche market. If they felt the only way to get something as cool as Chester Gould’s Dick Tracy out there was to make it familiar to the buyer by aping another collection’s design, then maybe it’s a small price to pay. If, however, Ashley Wood simply copied Seth’s design on his own out of laziness, that’s where you get into Vanilla Ice territory.
So yeah, if I were Seth, I’d probably be pissed at Ashley Wood. But if I were Chip Kidd, I’d be pissed at Seth (I’d also be gay, too).
“Yeah, but hip-hop artists sample from something old making something new and different.”
Not always, Tim. I seem to remember Eminem sampling Dido’s “Thank You” for his song “Stan.” Both songs were contemporaries and both became big hits.
And as far as Picasso stealing goes, I’m sure it was more along the lines of stealing a way to create a line, or colors, or feeling. When Picasso stole something from another artist, I doubt that artist even knew. Whatever the case, I’m sure it was never as blatant of a theft as the cover Ashley Wood “designed.” So, (and I know I’m really going out on a limb here by saying this) Picasso remains a genius in my book.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Vanilla Ice? That’s harsh.
Good. It should be when you suggest that it is ethical to do such a thing.
I just wasn’t sure it warranted the Why So Weak Award.
Well since you aren’t on the Award Committee, tough shit :)
If they felt the only way to get something as cool as Chester Gould’s Dick Tracy out there was to make it familiar to the buyer by aping another collection’s design, then maybe it’s a small price to pay.
There wasn’t anything that looked like the Peanuts books when it came out – Fantagraphics took a chance with the design of it, and it paid off. I think their design for the new Dennis the Menace collections and the Popeye collections are following that tradition where the form follows the function and the design fits the material perfectly.
It’s a risk, but not really – I think the demand for Gould’s work is out there.
I guess it’s just that I know that IDW is a small publisher who made only $333,492 in sales in August.
I don’t care how much they made. They stole. Period. Fantagraphics doesn’t/wasn’t making a lot of money at the time either and they still did the right thing. So that is a bullshit excuse. If you can’t pay, you can’t play.
Seriously, I admire IDW for what they’ve been able to do. Carving out a niche for themselves in this market is tough, but they’ve been able to do it. That’s why this pisses me off so much.
Where did the number come from anyway, Diamond? What about their book market sales?
So yeah, if I were Seth, I’d probably be pissed at Ashley Wood.
Which I’d like to reiterate that I don’t know for sure he did it – I just read that on a forum. The whole thing seems weird because it doesn’t match what he would do at all.
But if I were Chip Kidd, I’d be pissed at Seth.
I think Seth’s work is pretty consistent in style – his Peanuts work fits right in with the rest of his work.
And as far as Picasso stealing goes, I’m sure it was more along the lines of stealing a way to create a line, or colors, or feeling. When Picasso stole something from another artist, I doubt that artist even knew. Whatever the case, I’m sure it was never as blatant of a theft as the cover Ashley Wood “designed.”
So what is your argument here really, because this seems to shoot holes into everything you posted previously?
All that is left the defense of a small business for stealing because it is a small business in a tough market.
Boo-hoo. If it’s too tough, get out of the market.
Okay, one last time, I’ll try and explain what I was saying. I agreed the cover design theft was weak. Just not maybe Why So Weak Award worthy. Why? Because I could understand, from a publishing standpoint, why it was done. And at least it still made a nice package. But I never meant to imply it was ethical (so thanks for putting words in my mouth). I’d also like to add that if I were in charge of the project’s art direction at IDW, I would have gone a different route and made something original.
Why? Because from a design perspective, I agree with you. I’ve agreed with you the whole time! I said it was Puff Daddy design. I also said that if Ashley Wood or whoever “designed” the cover just did it that way on their own, they were just being lazy. I’ve called it blatant this whole time! I would also now add that they should be ashamed. The only reason I put those quotes in their about stealing was to show that great artists steal as well, but there’s a difference in what they did and what Ashley Wood or whoever did (I admit, though, that last point could have definitely been made clearer).
And as far as saying IDW should get out of the game if that’s the best they can come up with, you’re the one who bought the freakin’ thing! Not me! Jeez! I come to your site for a little good-natured discussion and end up becoming the poster child for intellectual property theft. Yay!
Well, I’m just about done here at work, stealing from other designers. Guess I’ll drive home, listen to some “Ice, Ice Baby,” and re-read New Mutants #100. Hope you enjoy your Chester Gould book…
tIMNov 2, 09:55 AM
C – Yeah, but as kids we couldn’t buy Japanese toys like those in America, let alone Nebraska. It wasn’t like there was Transformers on onside of the isle, and bad ass Japanese Robotech models on the other. (If there was, I would have them all. Oh yes.)
Where as those two books you can buy, probably in the same store, probably on the same shelf.
Trying to create a similar design style in order to draw an audience away from an original product is bogus when it is purely for $$$.
And you’re right about Eminem. (cough cough crosspromotion BS)
I come to your site for a little good-natured discussion and end up becoming the poster child for intellectual property theft. Yay!
No one has accused you of any such thing. The main crux of your point of view is that it is okay for them to do this as a business though, and it isn’t.
I do know you and your standards (which are highly ethical – no one was putting words in your mouth), which is why I guess I’m baffled that IDW gets a free pass in your mind since they’re a small publisher.
And trust me – I’ve seen this happen before (read the post for my example – banner ads). I fight it everytime, and yes, it usually goes unnoticed and brings in more money for the business (as the competing business loses money – which in this case will be Fantagraphics most likely). But it still isn’t right. I completely understand why they did it, but I still condemn it.
Well, I’m just about done here at work, stealing from other designers. Guess I’ll drive home, listen to some “Ice, Ice Baby,� and re-read New Mutants #100. Hope you enjoy your Chester Gould book…
Again, no one here said anything personal about you or accused you of stealing work, so I don’t know how to respond to this. None of this was ever about you. Hopefully you’ll see that if you re-read this all later.
If I came on strong, it is because stunts like this devalue our profession. “Why pay for a design when you can just do what this guy did over here? They did all the work, now we’ll just slap our logos and colors on it and call it good!”
Sadly, yes, I did buy the product. Partly because I was still kind of baffled that it wasn’t Fantagraphics who published it at the counter (and I’m a designer for crying out loud, I notice shit like this usually but they had me fooled completely), but I mostly bought it because honestly, this market is so crappy that I may never have an opportunity to see Gould’s work in any format. And yes, I like IDW. A lot, actually. That’s why I hope that if/when they go back to print that they redesign the covers at least.
In the meantime, I’ll be throwing my cover out and designing my own.
“Well, I’m just about done here at work, stealing from other designers. Guess I’ll drive home, listen to some “Ice, Ice Baby,â€? and re-read New Mutants #100.”
I was trying to be funny. I was pretending to overreact and be overly sarcastic. Hard to convey over internet…
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Nov 2, 04:21 AM
Funny. I had a similar conversation last night regarding directors and designers. Sometime when I’m giving instruction they say “Remember that scene in blank, I want it to look like that.” or “Remember blanks apartment? Lets rent that movie so we can make our set look that.”
I despise the rip. There is something very cheap and unintellectual about referencing movies and TV when you are designing a movie or TV show.
That cover is pretty damn similar aka exactly. I guess you could call it a homage, but I don’t think the required time has past. Pretty lame, I agree.